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Not a lot of original artists know this, but the fanworks universe is a dangerous place to have an opinion. Everyone has their own preferences, their own flames, their own OTPs (One True Pairings), and their own feelings on touchy subjects like yaoi/shonen-ai and MPreg. This in essense is no real problem in an ideal world, because everyone should be entitled to their own opinion.

Unfortunately, some fans take it a little over the edge. In an obsessive craze, they will stick to their viewpoint like a lifeline and won't be afraid to attack those who oppose their opinion as a defense mechanism. I'm not talking constructive cricism here, I'm talking about flagerant flaming, bashing, insulting, and in the worst cases even threatening. Even when dA has a no-tolerance policy for such behavior, it still exists, here and elsewhere, and it's not pretty to be in that sort of conflict.

See, on the Internet, it's EASY to bash others because no one knows who you are. Everyone is free to express their opinion, be it respectful or not. The point I make often is that it takes a truly mature person to be respectful on the Internet.

I would like to present to you a conversation posted on my yaoi picture entitled "29. Happiness," a series of messages between a concerned member and I. Be warned, it's long.

Here's what he said:

Y'know, I know you may not take this well, and may very well hide this comment, but I'm just going to say it. I hold nothing against homosexuals as people, and I agree that it isn't right to call names, or be hateful. However, as a Christian, I don't think the idea of homosexuality as right, or pleasant, or beautiful. I'm not going to berate them for being what they are, but I'm not gonna say stuff like, "Way to go!", or "Gay pride all the way!". I don't support homosexuality, simply put. But more or less, there's more to this situation than the black and white. Not all people that don't support homosexuality are insensitive monsters or jerks. The Christian population in general is greatly misrepresented as being hateful and monstrous, but we AREN'T. All I'd really like to know is, what's so wrong with pairing Link with Zelda, or someone else, or Ed with a girl, or Edd with a girl, or Roy with a girl? Straight pairings aren't THAT bad for these characters. The reason people get outraged by this kind of stuff is usually because they see it as a misrepresentation of that character. I mean, let's face it, neither Link, nor Roy, nor Ed and Edd, or just about any character in a fan-yaoi pairing has really shown signs of homosexuality. I mean, ZADR? Ugh............But anywho.........I'm not trying to offend, so please don't take it that way.

A few very valid points made. And here's how I replied:

Nah, man, you have an opinion and you're entitled to it.
I'm not saying Christians are horrible people. It's the hardcore ones that won't leave other people alone that ruin their reputation as a whole, and I'm well aware of that. I never said Christians are horrid people (technically, I AM one XD). Just because you're religious doesn't mean you have to hate eveything your religion's against. My boyfriend's Catholic, and he's totally fine with gays, accepts that I am bisexual, and enjoys my work all the same.
There's nothing wrong with hetero pairings, not at all. To me, however... they seem... exhausted. I'm the kind of person that likes to explore unexpected aspects of characters and how they relate to each other. As for misinterpretation, I believe is all based on opinion and preference. Link, however, has no defined character; that leaves him open for all possibilities. I've seen him characterized as a big sweetheart and a cold-hearted bastard. With Link, there IS no misinterpretation, at least, that's what I believe. Others can interpret him however they please, I don't care, as long as they don't bash my interpretation. I'd never do that to them.
When you make characters do things or make decisions that is unexpected based on the character they've presented, that makes them three-dimensional. People are complex by nature; putting a character a little out of whack makes them seem more real. For example, let's take a popular pairing, like Edd and Eddy; you don't expect Eddy to be soft enough for a relationship, but he'll break out of that mold if his feelings for Edd are that strong. If the author/artist pulls it off well, it's truly a fascinating thing to look at and think about. I never look at EEnE the same now. XD
I'm not hiding this, because I want people to know my reasoning on this subject is.


So, I hear him out and give him my side of the argument, which I was only more than happy to. And how did he reply?

Hmmmm..........you make a very fine point. Nothing wrong with getting along and agreeing to disagree about some things, right? Friends?

Absolutely. This is what happens when someone is intelligant enough to ask "why?", listen in, and come to an understanding and, as he said, agree to disagree.

I posted this in a journal, trying to show this point, and everyone was surprised. No bashing, no flaming, no antagonism, nothing! And I don't blame their shock. Conversations such as these are seldom found on the Internet, which unfortunately reflects the overall intelligant quota of the fanbase population.

This is a message to all fans. Everyone says it, and it's the honest truth: if you don't like it, don't look at it. You can't please everybody with your opinion, but you should be able to express it without being harassed by ignorance. THAT is my main point. Conversations like the one above are not impossible. If we can all learn to respect each other, the fanbase will seem a lot less intimidating. Let's all love our games, shows, comics, and movies collectively, the way we wish.
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:iconlady-warrior:
lady-warrior Featured By Owner Mar 22, 2010
of course it can go both ways. Or even crossover pairing wise as well.
I'm not into yaoi so I avoid it. I DO NOT go onto yaoi pics and act like a idiot about it. It's not my thing so I'll just ignore it.
Reply
:icondaioh--sakura:
Daioh--Sakura Featured By Owner Dec 27, 2008
I'm Catholic and love yaoi, bl games and slash pairings. I can easily understand why someone might be offended by it. What I do not understand is why they see the title, 'contains BL' or 'LxLight,' and go ahead to FULL SCREEN it and complain.

You have the power to click the 'x' in your inbox, unwatch me because I offend you, or look away. It takes about 2 seconds to click away from something offensive.
How long does it take to stare at the image and judge it, complain, and not even comment on the art ITSELF--only the content?

You don't see me clicking full-view on an image of naked inflation yiff art. I don't like it, but I'm not going to burn an artist for drawing it.

I am grateful for my kind watchers and friends who are not into the 'fujoshi' things, and have the courtesy to comment on the ART, bad or not; and say 'I'm no fan of this kind of thing at all, but the wings are really well done. How about putting more detail into the color though?'

*longrant is long*

It would be nice to live in a world where we could all have INTELLIGENT conversations, like with the person you described in your article. To be able to agree to disagree, and remember this is an ART site, not a site meant to offend. <3 It is nice to see a smart fangirl, speaking things other than 'FOK OFF SASUGAY IS MENT 4 NAROOTO, SO FOK OFF YAOI RULZ LOL N U SUK.'

Long live the smart fangirls. <3
Reply
:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Jan 6, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
Here, here! Yeah, I've never been a fan of inflations, but I don't go around telling those artists so. I have my obsessions (werewolves... :drool: ), they can have theirs. ^^
Haha, I have a guy who dubs himself "NN1's #1 fan," and he's always like "AUUGHHH I HATE THIS PAIRING BUT THE ART IS SO AWESOME!" XD
Don't worry, I can appreciate long rants. XD
Reply
:icondaioh--sakura:
Daioh--Sakura Featured By Owner Jan 6, 2009
Lol that's nice to hear!! :heart: it's great to have fans who don't agree with you, yet stick around for the art--it must mean that they really see potential and like your style. >w0
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:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Jan 6, 2009  Professional Digital Artist
^^ Indeed! And I only keep getting better! I should, I'm going to an art school, after all. XD
Reply
:iconhihi-san:
Hihi-San Featured By Owner Dec 6, 2008
You make very valid points. I will admit that I, too, am one of the people who have gotten into arguments about this sort of thing, but I don't make a huge deal of it. Very nice article~
Reply
:iconzeiferrei:
ZeiferRei Featured By Owner Nov 14, 2008
Very well put. :)
Although, the entire world lacks people like this (see: Politicians)
Reply
:iconpieandchips666:
pieandchips666 Featured By Owner Aug 10, 2008
Oh, this is so true. I, originally Christian but now Agnostic, don't personally don't give a rat's ass about homosexuality. I don't care if gays get married or if they adopt children. Now, I also don't care if they're denied rights for being gay. But I do believe that gays have every RIGHT to get married (or on South Park in one episode be "butt buddies"). What I DO have a problem with is how utterly retarded some fans can be, it's okay to LOVE a series, but making it your life and cosplaying outside of Halloween is just wrong.
Reply
:iconlasilla:
Lasilla Featured By Owner Jun 24, 2008  Student Interface Designer
You make a very good point. I mean, I'm catholic, and I find some of that Yaoiness offensive. I look, and I don't comment. That's all. One of my motto's is "If you don't have anything nice to, then shut you trap and leave me the fudge alone." I think it's really retarded when people flame on stuff like that. People have there own opinions, and that's okay. Flamers and bashers tend to think that they're the only one allowed to have one. Most of those people are really inconsiderate. I just gets me really mad when they keep going, and going, even when you stop replying. D:> Trust me, I've been through it. DX
To conclude, this is probably one of the best articles in the news section. You have my fav. :3
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:iconsaladianna:
Saladianna Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2008
I'm very much far behind from this update, But I agree very much with this, If hate didn't exist then this world wouldn't be so twisted.
Reply
:iconbooster4444:
Booster4444 Featured By Owner Mar 26, 2008
So Right! Nice To See More People With That Attitude!

Yeah, I'm Pretty Much Like That, Too. I Really Hate All This Flaming And Bashing Of People Who Don't Share Your Opinion. Everyone Is Entitled To Respect For Their Opinion, So Long As They Respect Others' Opinion. I Love Debates Like That. Where People Disagree Respectfully To Each Other. Way To Go For Both You And That Person!
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:iconkovitlac:
Kovitlac Featured By Owner Jan 14, 2008  Hobbyist General Artist
Reading the first of the messages, I found myself agreeing exactly with this other person. Not that I don't see things the way you do. I, too, am guilty of some questionable fan drawings:)

One other thing to remember is that you also don't have to be Christian to be against homosexuality (and saying against, I mean not to the point of being insulting or rude). True it's a generality of the Christian faith to see homosexuality as a sin. It's like how Christianity teaches us not to steal, but it's not just Christians who see it as wrong..
Reply
:iconsasmetalla2:
sasmetalla2 Featured By Owner Jan 7, 2008
Not only does this go into the whole gay-or-neigh issue, but you address that translating a character into your own interpretation does NOT mean it's out of character.

I'm Christian, and bi-sexual. I'm not what you'd call a true yaoi-fangirl, but my favorite couple happens to be yaoi. XD It just depends on the coupling and character interaction :3 I think a lot of the same-sex couplings are attractive because they usually challenge a more social aspect of the relationship, as apposed to the animal instinct. It just kind of demands to be well-written and thought-provoked, I guess.
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:iconearthphantomts:
EarthPhantomTS Featured By Owner Jan 4, 2008   Writer
Yeah, that's so right! I don't see why some people are so desperate for attention that they resort to being trolls on the net, you know? As for me, I'm not as much of a yaoi fan (at least partly because yuri's more my thing, not because of any religion I may or may not have), but I won't flame anything Red LinkxBlue Link (or for that matter, anything CarockxGanondorf, which was done by another very mature Christian lady who'll remain nameless but she's someone I have a fair bit of respect for, but I digress) and, anyway, I think this guy sounds like someone who I may want to be friends with.

I'll go ahead and say, though, that really, saying "Internet fanboys/fangirls are dumb as a race" is a bit like saying "Christians are evil as a religion"; simply untrue. There are some that fall through the cracks, but many of us (and when I say "us", I'm admitting that I'm a Veran fanboy here) are truly respectful, cordial beings. It's just that, well, most of us don't say anything at all, while the flamers do spew out sh*t, so they're the ones you see, you know?

In any case, faving this zig, for great justice.
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:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Jan 5, 2008  Professional Digital Artist
Ooooh... good point. I forgot that many people have the intelligence to keep their mouths shut. Very valid point. Sorry if I offended, I tend to be blunt and it's been close to getting me into trouble. ^^;
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:iconearthphantomts:
EarthPhantomTS Featured By Owner Jan 5, 2008   Writer
Hey, it's cool ;).
Reply
:iconshortkitty:
shortkitty Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008   Photographer
Thank you. Honestly. People need to get over the fact that it's someone else's opinions and that they're entitled to them.

Like, on one of my fanfictions (an AxelRoxas fic, it wasn't nasty or dirty or anything, just a sweet little drabble) on Fanfiction.net. Someone sent me a private message saying how awful yaoi is and that all its fans should go to hell and that homos are disgusting, etc. I PM'd them back, explaining my views on the relationship and that they shouldn't be so biased. Well, that somehow made me an 'ugly bitchy whore' and they just decided to start insulting the pairing and fandom and yaoi in general again. I decided it was a lost cause, so I just ignored them. But that's happened so many times, I'd be rich if I got a freakin' PENNY for every PM I get from FFN on yaoi and why it's so terrible.

I don't really get WHY it's so awful to think that Axel and Roxas have a relationship that goes past friendship. The same with Sora and Riku. Hell, I read so many SoraKairi, RikuKairi, and RoxasNaminé fics, but they're just not as... I dunno. They're never quite as sweet and happy like the yaoi fics. They usually just involve Kai seducing Sora or Riku, or Nami giving Roxas some drawing lessons. They're never have quite as many layers as yaoi fics and fanart, so I don't look at them quite as much.

AxelRoxas is my OTP, I'm not afraid to admit it. They both have such unique personalities and it's easy to imagine them falling in love with each other. Either by Axel's obsession and want to be human and feel again, or Roxas' subdued nature and quest to be a Somebody again. And Axel did promise Roxas to see him again in the next life, and if anybody saw the KHIIFM+ scene of them on the clock tower... well, that pretty much made me fall in love with them all over again. But there is one thing that nagged at me in the game, Roxas cried through Sora at Twilight Town because he was leaving Hayner, Pence and Olette behind. But he didn't cry for Axel, while he faded away in front of Sora and admitted that all he wanted to do was see Roxas one last time? That Roxas had made him feel like he had a heart and the only reason he did that damn suicide attack to save Sora was because he thought maybe - just maybe - Roxas would see him through Sora's eyes, and Roxas would remember the promise that they would meet again. Yeah, that just... disappointed me, I suppose.

Same with Sora and Riku, I just love those two together. And I can see them falling in love with each other because Kairi had been out of the picture for, what? Two years? They might have grown desperate and wanted some support, wanted something to hang onto while their lives were slowly crumbling around them and they realized that they might never see their home (or Kai) ever again. And the scene where Kairi finally reunited them in the Castle That Never Was and Sora feel to his knees, clutching Riku's hand, sobbing that he thought he'd never find him again, that he was so glad to have Riku back. I was sobbing along with Sora during that scene. And then there was that last scene... oh god. I was crying then, too. Because Riku said he was content to just stay in the twilight forever - with Sora. That he didn't mind going back to their home - as long as he was with Sora. And Sora said the same thing, that it would be nice if he could just rest for a while, and catch up with Riku. If that's not proof enough...

And I just now realized how long this is. 8D Sorry to ramble so much, but I felt the need to say it somewhere. So many people bitch about us yaoi fans and how we're practically the devil incarnate, but honest to god we're NOT. We're just passionate about the characters and their relationships. And many of us like hetero and yuri, too. And has anyone ever noticed that yuri never gets quite as much BS as yaoi does. Totaaly unfair in my opinion, but whatever.

It's nice to see somebody who can act civilized while on the internet. Kudos to you, my friend!
Reply
:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008  Professional Digital Artist
No, no! I encourage at-length discussion. It shows how definite you are in your position.

I could talk to you all day about Link and Roy or Ed and Double D. XD

Geez... I don't get THOSE kinds of PMs. I guess I've just garnered too much respect as an author to be attacked (no offense to you... I've been writing for years ^^;).

I DO, however, get a couple flames here and there where someone says they're throwing up or whatever. I even got on review where thewy were all "EWWW YAOI anyways, can you go check out my fic?" I was thinking "HELL NO," but I politely replied, "sorry, I only give the same respect I'm given." And then he told me to go "jump off a fething cliff." ...yeah. XD

Staright flamers are more entertaining than insulting to me because they usually lack intelligence. XD There's a difference between them and the guy I chatted with. THAT guy I can fully respect.

Thanks! ^^
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:iconshortkitty:
shortkitty Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008   Photographer
lol RoyEd was my OTP a couple years ago. 8D Opposites attract, ne? I could rant about them, but that last post practically killed my hand. XD And in your article, the thing you said about Link? So very true, glad to see someone else sees him as a character who's open to so many possiblities. And like whoa. I've never even THOUGHT of there being yaoi in Ed, Edd & Eddy. You just opened up a huge wave of possibilities to me, m'dear. ♥

No offense taken. XD I only took of fanfictions last year, and I often argue the hell outta people.

And you've given up on the KH front? lulz How ironic, seeing as that's what I ranted about. 8D And you're welcome!
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:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008  Professional Digital Artist
Well, I still enjoy the game, I just try to stay away from crazy rabid fangirls. XD Not that you are, of course.

EEnE yaoi? Yup, I didn't see it either until fanart opened my eyes. XD Now I never look at the show that same way. XD
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:iconshortkitty:
shortkitty Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008   Photographer
Aw, thanks! ^^ I try not to come across as the crazy kind of fangirl. XD

Yeah. I know I'll never look at it the same way. Like... Anybody x Kevin much? 8D

And sorry about all the typos. I double-check my posts, but it seems my last two didn't turn out terribly understandable. D:
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:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008  Professional Digital Artist
Oh, don't talk to ME about typos. xD I'm convinced than keyboards are evil contraptions bent on the destruction of the Emglish language. :D
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:iconshortkitty:
shortkitty Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008   Photographer
The Emglish language, eh? Boy, would I like to learn htat. :XD:
Reply
:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008  Professional Digital Artist
...........$&#*)^#)!!!
I TOLD YOU!!! XDDDD
Reply
(1 Reply)
:iconllama-shaman:
llama-shaman Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008
take no offense: but I agree that it is slightly odd when people pair Riku and Sora together when it's obvious that both of them love Kairi. Then they get mad when they find out that Sora and Riku like her because it's true. ;_; It's confusing. But good points are made here.
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:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008  Professional Digital Artist
I've kinda given up on the KH front. Those fans scare me. XD
Yeah... whatever you believe, y'know?
Reply
:iconllama-shaman:
llama-shaman Featured By Owner Jan 3, 2008
xD Don't they, though? lol. And that's true.
Reply
:icontwilightred7:
TwilightRED7 Featured By Owner Dec 24, 2007
"However, as a Christian, I don't think the idea of homosexuality as right, or pleasant, or beautiful."
i hate that. chirstans dont hate gays, and he doesnt need to relate that way. but im glad you told him the truth and he listoned.
this makes a really good point.
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:iconmeweevee:
MewEevee Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2007
Exactly!
Reply
:iconfelixfalora:
FelixFalora Featured By Owner Dec 26, 2007
Wow, TwilightRED7 hit the entire bullseye. JOHNEY, WHERE'S MY CASH, I NEED TO SHOWER HER WITH IT... WHAT D'YOU MEAN IT'S GONE?!
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:icontalescaper:
Talescaper Featured By Owner Dec 24, 2007  Hobbyist Photographer
I think this illustrates very well why fanart in itself has a hard time establishing itself as a real respected artform. Not only because its parasitic in the way that it can only come from another original work of art, but it also follows very strict lines that limit the way the fan-artists think. There's two directives in their work: 1. the original work of art and its universe and 2. the vision of the fanartist on how they would like that universe to be. Of course your work will receive a lot of negative criticism if it deviates from either of those directives. Which, essentially, you always will because everyone has a different interpretation of the original work of art.
What does this mean for the fan-art community? Well, they can never get any real criticism on their own style and technique because the main focus for the public of the work will be 'does it look like I want it to look'. The 'real' artscene as far as I can see it, has a much bigger leniency on the content and allows for more personal artistic development.
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:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2007  Professional Digital Artist
...I would have to disagree with you on that.
Fanart is still real art because we fanartists put in just as much energy and heart into our art as any other artist will.
I told you, you can please everybody, but you're still expressing yourself through it, and therefore it is still considered art.
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:icontalescaper:
Talescaper Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2007  Hobbyist Photographer
Actually, you're not expressing yourself. At least, the artwork of a fan-artist is not 100% their own work by definition. You're expressing yourself within the boundaries of someone else's art. That's the limitation I'm talking about.
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:iconnintendo-nut1:
Nintendo-Nut1 Featured By Owner Dec 25, 2007  Professional Digital Artist
I see. You make a good point, but I'm not saying I'm agreeing with you. Let's follow the example, agree to disagree, and leave it at that, shall we?
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:icontalescaper:
Talescaper Featured By Owner Dec 26, 2007  Hobbyist Photographer
hehe I suppose. I just wish some people on this site grew out of their constant 'admiration-imitation' and started being really imaginative.
Reply
:icondrowvisionary:
DrowVisionary Featured By Owner Dec 21, 2007  Hobbyist Digital Artist
A very wonderful article, and I wish more people had such a mindset.

I'd be more profound, but it's 11 in the morning and I need sleep. Forgive me, lol.
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:iconshyrofoxfeather:
ShyroFoxfeather Featured By Owner Dec 20, 2007
That's really fascinating! I never expected people acting like that in fandom, however, I've never really witnessed flames and fights between the fans either. ^^

Except for blatant obvious ones that get you at every corner. Like Tea (from Yugioh) bashing. I don't really like her but putting her in a fanfic JUST to bash her is really obnoxious. -_-o

Great article! You're a superb writer!
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:iconnerolynx:
NeroLynx Featured By Owner Dec 20, 2007
well I for one am defenately bashing fags for what they are. FAGS! gfto faggets.
Reply
:icondungeonmaster11:
dungeonmaster11 Featured By Owner Jan 1, 2008
How about ya stop being a bigot, huh? If you've opinions THAT negative, try keeping 'em to yourself. You're just making yourself look like a jerk.
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:iconsaladianna:
Saladianna Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2008
I might be late, but he been banned three times.
Reply
:icondungeonmaster11:
dungeonmaster11 Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2008
Well, I hope he learned his lesson. Kinda doubtful, considering how most 'internet a-holes' are, but who am I to judge?
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:iconsaladianna:
Saladianna Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2008
Same here though he's not giving people trouble on YouTube I'm quite surprised, however we do deal with such idiots who spew nonsense out of their mouth.
Reply
:icondungeonmaster11:
dungeonmaster11 Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2008
Right. Good luck to you, me, and the rest who have to deal with 'em then.
Reply
:iconsaladianna:
Saladianna Featured By Owner Apr 23, 2008
Yes indeed...I say that cos an idiot just telling me to get lost all cos I'm defending a friend....I give up...I can be really nice and people treat me like trash...no wonder I left dA...and the Internet.
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:iconsaladianna:
Saladianna Featured By Owner Dec 20, 2007
You shouldn't bash people for how they are you jerk!
Reply
:iconnerolynx:
NeroLynx Featured By Owner Dec 20, 2007
its a choice. i dont want to be mean so im not talking about this any more
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:iconfelixfalora:
FelixFalora Featured By Owner Dec 26, 2007
I think it's a little too late. I, myself, will admit that I am for bashing assholes whenever I see one... ASSHOLE RIGHT OVER HERE PEOPLE!
Reply
:iconsasha2999:
Sasha2999 Featured By Owner Dec 20, 2007  Hobbyist Digital Artist
That was great! Lovely to see some understanding in fandom. :aww:
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:iconjuen:
Juen Featured By Owner Dec 19, 2007
that's amazing~ what a wonderful conversation. I agree that on the internet people are more likely to attack because they cannot see the person whom they are attacking. Respect should be present on the internets, just like it is in real life. There's no need for confrontation.

Props to both you and the guy you were talking with~ brilliant!
Reply
:iconhylian-dragoness:
hylian-dragoness Featured By Owner Dec 19, 2007  Hobbyist Traditional Artist
nice article!
Reply
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